Friday, December 14, 2007

Quack of the week: Healing Water Online

In our last quack of the week, Kamel exposed companies selling algae found in pond water, and claiming they could harness the power of your stem cells. This week I found an even more impressive treatment: tap water. That's right someone has found a way to sell you tap water with the premise that it will heal you. And it's not even Coca-Cola.

Here is the explanation. First you have to accept the fact that genes do not control life. That's a lie. We just repeated it for so long that that we have come to believe it is true. But apparently it was never tested scientifically. If you don't believe me, watch this video. The quack behind this video is Dr. Bruce Lipton, who apparently was teaching medicine at the University of Wisconsin. He also wrote a book called the "Biology of Belief", which is a deceptive title since it's actually about changing your own biology with your mind. The irony of which seems to be lost on the author. Apparently he's also pretty much discovered epigenetics, which if you were not aware explains how energy from the mind alters protein expression.

While lots of nutjobs seem to love the book, there are few amusing reviews on amazon such as this one by a Columbia University researcher:

"Furthermore, Dr. Lipton claims that illness can be cured by mere belief. This isn't only nonsense; it is incredibly unprofessional and irresponsible. This is the equivalent of a TV Evangelist banging his palm against the foreheads of cancer patients, pushing them back down in their seats and proclaiming them cured, only to then say later to an investigating reporter who mentions that the patients later died that the Lord's magic stopped working because doubt entered into the hearts of the disbelieving patients. What an incredibly cruel sentiment. "

Which brings me back to water. Dr Lipton's ideas have inspired the creators of "Healing Water Online" because apparently your mind can also alter water and vice-versa. Now I'm sure a cold shower can elicit some spiritual experiences in some people (I highly recommend that link). In fact I often praise the lord when somebody flushes while I'm in the shower. But this is different. Somehow, this has to do with the energy you can produce with your mind, and the unique properties of water. For example did you know that:

"Water's reputation as a powerful solvent derives from its ability to absorb energy vibrations and its particular electromagnetic and chemical qualities, being able to break down substances into their constituent parts. Naturally flowing water creates complex structures: micro clusters of vibrating energy centres, constantly receiving and transmuting energy from every contact the water body makes; and laminar structures which generate energy from the interaction of the planes against each other."

So how can I harness this power you ask? Well it's easy, you just need to buy a $144 jug that has a propeller inside. Why? Well isn't obvious by now:

"The compact motor housed in the lid of the 2-litre jug drives a left-turning silver propeller wich forms a beautiful vortex throughout the depth of the plain tap water for 3½ minutes; this re-enlivens, restructures, reoxygenates and purifies the water by the spiral movement alone.
The energy wave field of normal tap water is 35 cm; Living Water Vortex Jug's is 2,4 metres! A healthy person has an energy wavelength of about 1,9 metres, and as a person consists of 75% water, s/he will be regenerated by the greater energy of restructured water."

Wow what a deal. That's almost a 26% increase of your wavelenght, or only 88 cents per centimeter! And they also suggest you combine your healing water with long distance healing. That's right, for only $44 they will channel energy to you, sorta like what kamel's power to make people dumb at a distance. Actually it's exactly like that.


46 comments:

kamel said...

"The energy wave field of normal tap water is 35 cm; Living Water Vortex Jug's is 2,4 metres! [...] s/he will be regenerated by the greater energy of restructured water."

Maybe somebody is making ME dumber at a distance, but if I recall my high school physics (which is by no means a sure thing) the relationship between wavelength and energy is an inverse one. That is, longer wavelength means lower energy, which runs counter to their claims.

Anantaji said...

what a bunch of BS, you guys suck, and mis-inform the public

Anonymous said...

Wow, that's a very compelling argument Anantaji...

Rob Frost said...

While I can imagine this guy being a quack, there's still so much we don't understand about water - eg. There are tests being done (by real scientists) which indicate that our consciousness and intention can interact with water and effect ice crystal formation - trippy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4nK6W7FoFk

Anonymous said...

Just because you do not know about someting does not mean it does not exist. In fact, it makes you look like a moron to the people who do know it exists. You have such a lack of knowledge about what is really happening at the cutting edge of discovery, and what you are commenting on, that you should save yourself from further embarrassment.

Kamel said...

Anonymous, since you presumably do understand it and 'know it exists' (You're not just accepting without understanding, right?) maybe you can explain why their claims run counter to basic, high school physics as I mentioned in my initial comment.

Anonymous Coward said...

Wow if anyone needs to be embarrassed it's this guy. What he says is obviously just a string of unintelligible words he borrowed from physics without understanding any of their meaning. This is a smokescreen designed to fool simple-minded gullible people who don't understand high-school physics. Not to mention that there is not a shred of evidence that this could work. Do you know what an energy field is? A vector field describes the direction and energy of a particle subject to that field. To say that the "energy wave field" of tap water, which doesn't exist, is 35 cm long which doesn't make any sense, is so wrong that it makes it funny. And then he goes on to talk about wavelength (the distance traveled by a particle during one period) of a human. That does not make sense, people don't have periods and frequencies. Well I guess women do, but you can bet they travel more than 1.9 meters in 28days. But hey if you want for $144 I'll sell you water with wavelengths of 100km and a quantum jug that entangles water molecules with Higgs Bosons.

Anonymous said...

Regarding this whole water deal, I haven't a clue, but I do think that Lipton has a lot of accurate information to offer, calling him a quack isn't going to get anywhere.

Anonymous said...

All very well, but still finding a general lack of information on why Lipton is wrong. Just a bunch of smug grad students telling us that what he is saying is not what they were taught at uni. I wonder if there were smug grad students sitting around in 1543 saying "Have you read 'De revolutionibus orbium coelestium'? No, me neither. Why would I want to, the Earth is self evidently the centre of the universe. That Copernicus, what a quack."

Anonymous Coward said...

What Lipton is saying is not even wrong, it's a bunch of words that make no sense strung together to look authoritative. To top it off he has no evidence to prove his point, unlike the example you provide. But if you are so gullible to buy the magic water, well a fool and his money are soon parted. The reason these quacks make so much money peddling bogus cures is that the world is filled with feeble morons like you.

rob said...

Are there any examples of "snake oil" salesmen or saleswomen being proven right after some amount of time?
I can't think of one.
James Lind, the guy who discovered that scurvy was preventable with citris fruits (and the first guy to do a clinical trial) you could argue was one. Although he had no financial interest in selling citrus fruits and didn't push his ideas hard. AND he had evidence... nevermind, can't think of ONE.

rob said...

O and BTW bayblabbers,
just because it runs counter to high school physics just means that you weren't taught quantum physics.
Matter does have a wavelength and frequency.
check it out. All those pop science physics books talk about it.
Of course, that doesn't make this healing water work. I would like to know how he claims to alter the wavelength of water since it is basically a function of it's mass and velocity.

Anonymous Coward said...

Hiding bullshit in quantum physics is a standard practice that quacks use to deceive people. Because few people can claim to understand quantum physics they think their bullshit can go unchallenged. Pretty much every quack we've ever profiled used this tactic. New-agers somehow adopted quantum physics terms and incorporated them in their mysticism, and worse use it as an example of how science cannot comprehend natural laws when it's just the oppposite. Quantum physics enables us to do incredibly precise measurements. And i guanrantee you that "The energy wave field of normal tap water is 35 cm; Living Water Vortex Jug's is 2,4 metres! A healthy person has an energy wavelength of about 1,9 metres" is complete and utter bullshit.

Kamel said...

Well Rob, I actually did learn that all matter has a wavelength in high school.

My point was that even if his wavelength changing magic is true, he has it totally backwards - short wavelength equals high frequency and high energy. If he changes the wavelength from 35cm to 2.4m he *lowers* the energy. There's no way you could "be regenerated by the greater energy of restructured water" because the restructured water has LESS energy.

Now, as someone pointed out, maybe he's got some paradigm-shifting new wave theory that is counter to basic wave physics we learn in highschool. Fine. If that's the case, first he needs to actually shift the paradigm and establish his new, opposite wavelength-energy relationship.

Then he has to show that the food 'wavelength' has some relationship to its ability to 'regenerate' you.

And even then, you don't need to buy this product because you can change the wavelength of, say, a peanut by having somebody throw it into your mouth rather than picking it up and eating it slowly.

So until then, I'm with AC and calling BS.

rob said...

Kamel had a very good science education I guess.
I seriously didn't mean to indicate that there was any legitimacy to the claims about healing water. I guess I was picking on AC's comment people don't have periods and frequencies, because they do.
But I'm totally going to eat my peanuts fast from now on, just in case.

Anonymous Coward said...

Well I guess we'll find out at the large animal collider in Geneva. You're being disingenuous, wave/particle duality collapses for large objects especially such an heterogeneous assemblage you'd find in a person/squirrel. However I'll grant you that the "left-turning silver propeller" does make waves in the water.

Kamel said...

It was my Catholic school. :)

Really, I just have a specific memory of having to calculate the wavelength of a thrown baseball once upon a time. But if you asked me to do it now, I probably couldn't.

Anonymous Coward said...

λ = h/p. Electrons, atoms, and all other particles have de Broglie wavelengths. The momentum of an object depends on its speed and mass, so the faster and heavier an object is, the larger its momentum (p) will be. Because Planck’s constant (h) is an extremely tiny number, the de Broglie wavelength (h/p) of any visible object is exceedingly small. In fact, the de Broglie wavelength of anything much larger than an atom is smaller than the size of one of its atoms. For example, the de Broglie wavelength of a baseball moving at 150 km/h (90 mph) is 1.1 × 10-34 m (3.6 × 10-34 ft). The diameter of a hydrogen atom (the simplest and smallest atom) is about 5 × 10-11 m (about 2 × 10-10 ft), more than 100 billion trillion times larger than the de Broglie wavelength of the baseball. The de Broglie wavelengths of everyday objects are so tiny that the wave nature of these objects does not affect their visible behavior, so their wave-particle duality is undetectable to us.

Kamel said...

Well, sure I could have looked it up. Encarta FTW.

http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761559884/quantum_theory.html

Anonymous said...

So, if you don't like the idea - don't buy it! It's your life. Why get so bitter and resentful about it? Learn more about quantum physics, the theories may prove not to be so preposterous sounding.

Anonymous said...

sad, hopefully you guys stay in the nice warm arrogant university to dispense the conventional dogma of the day and never enter the real world where you may actually have to apply your regurgitated text book bullshit from 50 years ago. It is a brave new world out there and 'time in science' may mature you yet. G-d forbid any of you become physicians and have to actually DO something to help your fellow humans. A biological system is so vast and multi-variabled
(yes I made up a goddam word), the brightest among you would run home to your mommas at the horror of a dying patient looking to you oh scientist for help. so a 'hearty fuck u' and I'll be on my way.

Kamel said...

Am I the only one who finds it hilarious when people who think they've single-handedly overturned decades of scientific understanding call *others* arrogant?

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allone said...

wow what an incredible waste of time and energy this blog is. actually putting your precious time and energy into this effort for what?? smells a bit fishy to me especially if you are supposedly an intelligent and articualte human being, are you being paid to do this or do you just have too much free time, trust fund, this whole blog smells of over privileged sarcastic shallow thinking!! whatever makes you feel better, but no matter what you subcribe too we all have the earth below our feet and the sky above our heads and it's time to end pissing contests like this!

Kamel said...

Waste of energy? But I have so much excess now that I've increased my personal wavelength!

Oops, sorry - there I go with shallow and sarcastic thinking again. Oh well, it's better than not thinking at all...

viagra online said...

It's really interesting who are investigating these theories is good to be aware of these issues

Noosha said...

First, I want to start off by saying that I'm an Athiest. I have never in life, nor has my family suscribed to the God formula. I am also a psychotherapist who has watched many patients experience the placebo effect. I don't know about all this 'holy water' crap. But I do believe that the mind is an amazing organ. We do have the capacity to alter our the machanics of our body with our mind.
I'm not saying we can cure cancer, but I am suggesting that not everything this dude says may be crazy. I've seen amazing things happen when we truly are able to utilize our mind to it's potential. Now as for changing our genetic structure?? I don't know, but I also don't think that it could be totally beyond our minds ability.
As people of science and reason, we have to be careful that we are able to look at all information objectivly and keep in mind that there are still many things we do not know about our ability to heal ourselves.

Anonymous said...

I watched Mr. Lipton's video and basically, all he is saying, is that your thoughts and beliefs can affect you physically, mentally, and emotionally so you should choose your thoughts carefully. What's so crazy about that?

aidan said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
aidan said...

Im not educated in biology or physics so on either side of the argument i have no reason to accept the facts with an understanding of the science behind them so im firmly on the fence and just thought it was an interesting topic that i wanted to read about. However i would assume that any person whos main intention is to prove that others are idiots and is more driven by trying to come across as funny is unwilling to listen and biased by their oven narcissistic tendencies. I think its an interesting topic that needs discussion but whoever lowers themselves to gross exaggerations and condescending assumptions in order to further their agenda is someone i would never listen to.

Kamel said...

Aidan wrote: "However i would assume that any person whos main intention is to prove that others are idiots and is more driven by trying to come across as funny is unwilling to listen and biased by their oven narcissistic tendencies."

Followed immediately by this: "whoever lowers themselves to gross exaggerations and condescending assumptions in order to further their agenda is someone i would never listen to."

Irony, FTW.

(Don't worry though, Aidan. Just this once, we'll take your advice and stop listening to you.)

Anonymous said...

But we know that we change protein fibers in the brain with our minds. In fact, we do most everything with our minds. Our brains control body movements but the decision to move seems to come from the mind. Do some research on protein fibers in the brain, neurotransmitters (particularly serotonin and dopamine). Our minds, attitudes, etc. do in fact have tremendous impact upon our bodies (including our brains). The brain is a fascinating and creepy area to study. Quantum Physics keeps coming to this junction where they necessarily have to look at consciousness in relation to reality. Studying nature is pretty cool... we have to let go of the thought that we already know everything. If we did, we would just be reciting... not learning. We are reverse engineering and we've come to an interesting turning point that may possibly go from reverse engineering to creating.

russell88 said...

the critiques in the blog post miss lipton's point completely - about belief healing - lipton says that all stimuli is belief. and it is. all experience takes place in the mind. that shit you just took? in the mind. that shower? in the mind. the chair you're sitting on? yeah...that too.

about the first bit and genes controlling life...did you even watch or read any of lipton's material? he says the genetic code is not responsible for the reactions of the organism. and it isn't. the fact that you're 5'8 and 170 pound male doesn't change the fact that an 18 wheeler is barrelling towards you making you jump out of the way - anyone will jump. he's saying if you change what you experience on a day to day basis, your life will change. and it will.

i don't know anything about the water deal i've only watched biology of perception. but the fact that you completely misunderstood and tried to misrepresent the whole idea of lipton's research shows that you have a relatively narrow understanding of the science of biology and perception.

i bid you good day.

russell88 said...

educate yourself...

http://www.tonyb.freeyellow.com/id68.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organelle

you guys are stuck in the fucking time of aristotle and descartes with your dualistic notions of a seperate mind ruling the body from some mystical control seat.

lipton's explanation for consciousness and perception makes perfect sense - you just haven't given it any honest thought so you don't see it.

A said...

You are a MORON.

Anonymous said...

The fact that this is such obvious nonsense and the fact that it is being discussed by anyone here as though it isn't... hurts. Feels bad man.

megalulz at captcha = jewakoo

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Anonymous said...

I have been a medical researcher, a student of genetics, an "energy" healer, and follower of contemporary thought. this theory is one more attempt to lead us away from truth. Sin exists and it eats away the information system imbedded in our connective tissue...like a computer virus it pollutes everything on a cellular level. there is no true health while it remains unconfessed and every DNA message is jammed without the blood of Jesus.

Anonymous said...

wow, it is really sad to see people who don't beleive in anything. Bruce Lipton's entire point is that, our own beliefs about ourselves affect our bodies on an energetic level,which in turn alters us physically. And if you are such great scientific minds, you would know that looking through an electron microscope, all we are is energy, and our thoughts are also energy that alter our brain chemistry, that in turn affecting our entire being.
So really think long and hard about what you are saying. You are trying to knock down the bridge between science and spirituality, because you are scared of change, that's all. Perhaps you should just sit and "feel" for a minute, and let yourself go to the place in your mind where you believe in something more than just mundane day to day existence. You know its there. It is in all of us. And share your smarts properly, by reaching farther out than you ever have before, to discover things you never thought were possible. Don't wanna tick you off, just trying to help!

Anonymous said...

What you all seem to be overlooking is the fact that the world is full of all kinds of absolute proof that mind can heal the body. What do you think placebo effect is? Do some research, there are some absolutely REMARKABLE cases of placebo healing and this is proven and undeniable. When a faith healer "heals" someone, he is not the responsible party, it is the one BEING healed, based on their BELIEF that the healer can heal them. And we all know that hypnosis has proven to be very helpful in accelerating healing. All these things are simply conditions that you set up via your thoughts, feelings and beliefs. I would suggest that those of you not believing the claims of Bruce Lipton should actually read the scientific evidence he provides in his books. His claims are backed by valid science. (Although I will say that he probably stretches some of his claims a bit in the same way a person telling you a personal anecdote might "enhance" the telling to make a better story out of it. The point is, most of what he says is supported with scientific proof and people need to realize that in many ways we really do create our own reality.
The planet is a fucked up place because we have fucked up beliefs in place that we feel a need to hold on to for our own security and peace of mind. Heaven forbid we should have to CHANGE our minds, then we couldn't be self righteous and express all this intellectual indignation that "proves" how smart we are.
The people who being dismissive, or worse, of Lipton's hypotheses sound exactly like the people who were outraged at the idea the the earth wasn't the center of the universe...and wasn't flat.

All truth passes through three stages: First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Pip said...

Well while you guys think you have it all laid out...
Just remember, if everyone stuck with the convential mainstream belief, the earth would still be flat, we would still be burning witches at the stake and the atom would be the smallest particle.
Look back in history and see how many cosmic jokes science has made of itself, each time thinking it knew better than before. ;)

True-dat said...

I'm with Noosha...

One thing that is rarely mentioned is that Science itself is the study of what already exists. Science does not make things what they are... it is simply man's relatively simplistic attempt to understand the complexities of what IS. We are at the tip of the iceberg in our understanding of ourselves and the world and so to be so adamant about "science" which is an ever changing hypothesis is premature.

One thing we have learned through history is that people generally ALWAYS believe that they have the answer in whatever time period they live... but sooner or later, something more is discovered that adds to our understanding and a lot of times, we find that what we thought was fact - is not.

To disallow the possibility of things that can't be proven as yet is showing a limited perspective of life. When something exists that we don't understand, the onus is not on that thing to conform to our prescribed ideas of science. We run it through a battery of tests based on our knowledge thus far, but a lot of times, those accepted methods of analysis do not work to explain it. So what do we have to do? - Try something new. Think out of the box, as it were.

The other thing I wanted to point out is that in some of the comments, when people talk about western medicine, they say "traditional medicine"... This is a misnomer because in FACT, traditional medicine is much older than Western medicine - Ayurevedic medicine for example, which is more than 4000 years old and treats the individual rather than the disease. Western medicine, which is good when you break your leg or are in a car accident, is quite recent in the scheme of things and is not necessarily as good as REAL traditional medicine when it comes to general health. The main difference is that traditional medicine looks at how disease or other contaminants affect each singular individual and their unique constitution while Western medicine tests for the disease itself and doesn't account for the huge variety of body environments. The holistic aspect of traditional medicine is that it allows for PREVENTATIVE measures and works at helping people figure out how their unique body can be at optimum health. Western medicine tries to address this superficially, but it often fails because again, it does not treat the individual constitution. Take the food guide for example - this definitely is not right for everyone.

Often, people who don't want to take responsibility for their lives, resist traditional medicine and opt for Western medicine where they can blame doctors for not being able to diagnose and cure their ills.

I personally believe that both medicines have their place and that to be closed minded to someone like Bruce Lipton who actually has PROVEN his assertions through a multitude of experiments and test groups(that the mind is our most powerful organ and we can affect our biology through it)is just that - closed minded.

True-dat said...

All that said - I don't personally believe the water restructuring thing through an expensive device. I do however filter my water and write words like "Love" and "Health" on the glass containers I drink it from. Why? Because intention is also a powerful thing, although it may not be tangible in the scientific world.

Sheldon said...

for specific information on how Bruce Lipton aims his ideas at gullible people..

http://www.mezonox.com/blog/2011/12/14/Sorry-Dr-Bruce-Lipton-fans-Mesonoxia-not-new-age.aspx

Anonymous said...

Mr emoto is not a dr and his " study" is a n art project with no scientific merrit. I fell for emoto too after watching "what the %#&% do we know?" Im replying from my phone otherwise i would give refferences, but look it up on Quackwatch.org

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http://www.mezonox.com/Positively-Delusional.html